In a 48 page Decision, a Federal Judge in Utah told the State of Utah, that they NEVER had any business in the religion business is the first place.
As a result, The U.E.P. Trust will go back to it's rightful owners, the people of the F LDS Chuch, and things will HAVE to revert back to where they were prior to the illegal taking. Among other things, that means that those who worked with Bruce Wisan at destroying the F LDS Church, will find themselves out on the street, rather than Church members.
The Article Below came off the front page of the Salt Lake Tribune. The Story was about the Federal Court's Decision that the taking of the Trust was un Constitutional, and therefore, illegal.
In the Decision the Judge literally said that Warren S Jeff's legal problems had NOTHING to do with the legitimacy of the taking.
SO WHAT PICTURE DID THE SALT LAKE TRIBUNE PUT UP CONCERNING THE DECISION?
The story was about a Trust, land, property, houses, business, dairies, a wiped-out zoo with all it's animals, and people being evicted from their homes.
Like Denise Lindberg, the Tribune goes back to the old whipping boy approach, the "Evil" Warren Steed Jeffs.
In 48 pages, the Federal Court said Warren's problems and the taking of the Trust are two different matters. Maybe the Tribune needs to read that Decision, and stop pandering to the haters and bigots of the F LDS Church.
In a decision that could have major implications on a long-running court battle, a federal judge ruled Thursday that the state of Utah violated the Constitution when it took over a polygamous sect’s property trust nearly six years ago.
U.S. District Judge Dee Benson’s decision is a victory for the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Days Saints. Its leader, Warren S. Jeffs, reinstated his legal control over the church last week from the Texas jail cell where he is awaiting trial on charges of bigamy and sexual assault.
"Virtually from its first step after it decided to reform the trust, the state court was in forbidden territory," Benson wrote.
"The defendants speak at long length about how bad — even criminal — Warren Jeffs’ behavior was, but they say little that is relevant to defend their own wholesale interference with an established church."
(The Salt Lake Tribune needs to read these words again, they don't seem to understand the English language.)
While state attorneys appeared to argue that the $110 million trust was supporting Jeffs’ criminal acts, that wasn’t the case officials made for taking it over in 2005 — and it hasn’t been proven in court, Benson wrote. The church’s property was inextricably tied to its religion, and the state’s attempt to pull the two apart was a violation of the separation between church and state, he decided.
"It’s a really great day for constitutional rights," said FLDS attorney Rod Parker, who represented 6,000 members of the church in the case. "It takes a lot of courage on the part of judge to say, ‘OK, I know this group is out of favor, but this isn’t right.’ "
In the short term, the decision grants a preliminary injunction blocking the sale of the 700-acre Berry Knoll Farm, considered sacred by the church. The long-term future of the trust, however, wasn’t immediately clear. A separate order will define the "precise extent" of the injunction, Benson wrote, though no hearings or deadlines were immediately set.
Attorneys for the state will likely appeal.
"We strongly disagree with Judge Benson’s ruling, and now we’re going to look at our options, including an appeal," said Paul Murphy, spokesman for the Utah Attorney General’s Office. Officials will consider their next move in a meeting next week.
(I read the Decision. The Federal Court Answered each and every Argument used by Utah for the Taking. Yes, they will probably Appeal, why not, it's certainly not their money going down the tube.
In the Decision, the Federal Court ripped Judge Lindberg a new one. This was no mere bitch slap, she got raped, justifiably.)
Valued at $110 million, the trust contains nearly all the property in the group’s home base in the twin towns of Hildale, Utah, and Colorado City, Ariz., along with its settlement in Canada.
Called the United Effort Plan, the trust was created in 1942 to fulfill the fundamentalist Mormon principle of communally holding property.
Before the state takeover, it suffused nearly all aspects of life for the church’s approximately 10,000 members. Their homes belonged to the trust, they worked in trust fields, factories and dairies, and the food they ate came from the trust, Benson wrote. All decisions were made by church leaders based on FLDS principles such as commitment to the faith.
The 2005 state takeover was virtually unprecedented, Benson wrote.
"The defendants cite no case that is even suggested to be remotely similar enough to the instant case to support their defense. This is because there isn’t one," he wrote.
(This is a Legal fact that NOT ONE LAWYER OR JUDGE IN UTAH UNDERSTOOD?)
The Attorney General’s Office made the move after FLDS trustees failed to respond to lawsuits filed in 2004 by former members seeking damages for abuse they suffered under Jeffs. The plaintiffs included a nephew who said Jeffs and other uncles sexually assaulted him as a child and six "lost boys," young men who said they were forced to leave the community to reduce the competition for wives.
(Three points for the Tribune for including child sex into the story, this will sell.)
State officials said they feared people could lose their homes if those plaintiffs were awarded hefty sums in damages.
(Which explains why UTAH took over and started evicting F LDS Church members from their homes and gave bogus "Dead's" to non-members only.)
The trust was structured so that if it failed, ownership reverted to Jeffs, who, in 2006, was charged with rape as an accomplice for presiding over the marriage between an unwilling 14-year-old girl and her cousin. His conviction was later overturned.
(I'm shocked the Tribune acknowledged the over turning of the case. Usually the story line is merely that he was an accomplice to allowing a man to "Rape" his cousin. By the way, there was NEVER anyone convicted of raping the girl, so being an accomplise to something that never happened was a neat trick on Warren's part, but had WHAT to do with the Trust? According to the Federal Judge; SQUAT!)
Third District Judge Denise Lindberg decided to reform the trust. She tried to avoid running afoul of the separation of church and state by removing religion from the trust itself. But for the FLDS, religion and property were so intertwined that any action was unconstitutional, Benson said.
"One may as well attempt to make Deuteronomy secular, or the Koran, or to eliminate football from the Super Bowl," he wrote.
(Or give her a brain.)
The only option the court had was revoking the trust — but that might have meant it reverted to Jeffs.
(Actually, revoking the Trust was NEVER an option; it is written, almost word for word, to the same exact Trust used by the LDS Church. If the F LDS Church Trust was "Illegal", so was the LDS Trust. Now as a member of the LDS Church, Denise couldn't choose that option, now could she?)
Instead, the court appointed accountant Bruce Wisan to run the trust.He began the process of separating the homes into subdivisions and giving back property to excommunicated members. At first, no FLDS members protested the decision or responded to repeated efforts to involve them in the case. Jeffs apparently ordered his followers to "answer them nothing" and disdained the land on the Utah-Arizona border in favor of a compound built in Texas, Benson wrote.
But the members no longer donated their time, labor and money to the trust. They stopped paying property taxes. With little money coming in and fees mounting, the trust fell into debt.
Then, in 2008, the same year Texas authorities raided Yearning for Zion Ranch, "Jeffs apparently had a change of opinion," Benson wrote. When Wisan proposed selling Berry Knoll Farm, the FLDS entered the legal fray.
A cascade of court hearings in St. George, Salt Lake City and Kingman, Ariz., followed. When the state court denied their petition to intervene in the case, the FLDS filed a federal lawsuit in 2008. Benson decided then to wait and let it play out in state court.
With additional legal costs adding to the financial woes, the trust fell more than $3 million in debt by August 2009. Conflicts over who had rights to farms, homes and the church cemetery proliferated. Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff admitted the situation was a "mess."
(His "Mess", he is in the pocket of dentist Dan Fisher, and was the front man for the Taking from day one.)
The church won delays of the Berry Knoll Farm sale, but it lost in Utah Supreme Court, which unanimously ruled last year that members had waited too long to challenge the takeover and restructuring. In October, FLDS attorneys revived the federal suit. Benson granted their request for a temporary restraining order.
"It is one thing for a state to tell a church and its members that they, just like all other residents of the state, may not smoke peyote, or commit child sexual abuse, or violate any other law of general application," Benson wrote. "But it is quite another thing, altogether, to reorganize the religious activities of such churches and their members to make them conform to the states’ version of appropriate secular behavior."
(There goes that pesky Constitution once again, Denise.)
But Wisan’s partner, W. Val Oveson, said he has been "preserving property and protecting the homes for families living on the UEP property ... for the last six years.
(For NON-F LDS Church members only.)
Clearly, the federal court is directly at odds with all five members of the Utah Supreme Court.
(Yes, the Federal Judge understands what the Constitution has to say about separation of Church and State. Do the 5 LDS members of the Utah Supreme Court bow to the Constitution, or the Quorum of the 12?)
We will continue to do our best to administer the trust while an even higher court resolves this dispute."
($1,000.00 bet says that Wisan is already lobbying the State to pay his bill for pilfering and ravaging the Trust assets over the past 7 years. He most certainly isn't going to be paid through the Trust for stealing it from the F LDS Church. Besides, cousin Bruce has a bigger problem on his hands; his "Trespassing" on F LDS property has now become Burglery of an Occupied dwelling since the Federal Court has Decided he had no Legal right on the properties to begin with.
Bruce may end up in prison with a Felony conviction added to his Resume'.)
And that's my opinion.
35 comments:
So who is in the picture?
From left to right, that's the banana man himself, Johnnie Hanna. Johnnie is the Texas Ranger who was in charge of the YFZ "Evidence" that was stolen during the attack on the Ranch. He then proceeded to hand out State's "Evidense" to anyone who would print negative stories about the F LDS Church, including Medical Records and pictures of children so folks could put their faces out on the internet as Kiddie Porn.
Next to him,is one of the "10 Most Wanted" men in America, Warren Jeff's who stands convicted, after 7 years in prison of no crimes, not even littering.
Next to Warren is Johnnie's girlfriend, Leslie Long.
Bringing up Johnnie's rear is Hoss Cartwright, or possibly another Texas Ranger trying to crack the case of Rozita Swinton, who MAY have made some phone calls, but the Rangers have been stumped on that "Investigation" for 3 years now, so we're not sure.
BillM you seem to have gotten ahead of Judge Benson's written order, beyond his present ruling that will define his "precise extent" of his injunction. Will he just reinstate the trust, liquidate it to the beneficiary(s) or award it to Warren S. Jeffs as his sole ownership? Then Mark Shurtleff could appeal his order to a higher court, so your opinion here is premature of the actual order or final outcome.
No it is not. Warren Jeffs owns the land. If they decide anything different, they are liars and theifs. and every one knows that. For every one knows if they are honest or not. A liar is a liar, and a thief is a thief. and they all know it. Even that Fisher man, who funds an attact. And Bruce Wisen who did steal the land. and all the people who are perverted, who steal the land. Yes, they all know it. and even the saints who lie and cheat know it.
Funny you don't mention all the men that have been kicked out by Warren lately; 45 as I understand??
Nor do you mention that young girls as young as 12-13 were brought across the border from Canada to marry the creep?
Fair is Fair Bill. Print the facts, too!!!
Hey, by the way, your buddy Wee Willie has been kicked out; guess that means no more phone calls for you to the ranch?? So sorry!!!
Hate to burst your bubble, but that isn't Brooks next to Warren. It's the Schleicher County Sheriff.
Glad to hear I was correct about Hoss.
Is a local goon now in to wearing a Texas Rangers urinal too?
You boys need to stop focusing on those 12 and 13 year old girls... You'll go blind; you'll grow hair on your hands; your eyes will cross and stay that way; it will make you retarded; you'll run out of juice; you'll start stuttering and your dicks will fall off; God will strike you dead; your mother will find out.
Try sports or taking a cold shower.
BillM you are a very unique Child Advocate. Now that the RCMP have launched their investigation into eight teen brides, five married to Warren Jeffs, and all sex trafficked over the Canadian border, I take it you will keep yourself deaf, dumb and blinded to the felony child abuse crimes that were originally brought to light during the YFZ Raid. Maybe you need to find a new hobby BillM, you obviously suck at being an amateur childhood defender against pedophiles.
How many children were returned to the 'Scene of the Crimes' at the YFZ Ranch? I guess you believed the teen Canadian girls found at the YFZ who claimed to be there visiting their granny, Granny Warren, that is.
well, if Flora Mae was abused by her Father and no one did anything about it; maybe all her sister's are liar's. Maybe that is one way that they deal with life, is blaming every one else for What their father did. I wonder if they feel like they hate enough, it will undo his abuse. Or if they forgive, enough it will make what he did not noticable. I guess that is why they all protect abuser's. If they lie eneough maybe they feel like his abuse did not happen. if they pretend hard enough. Maybe that is why they hate so much. I feel baddly for Flor Mae. I was going to read her book, and after the first page, I could not stand it. I did not want slimed with the details. and it is a pity that Aunt Martha in her love did not try to fix the problem, instead of slaming the girl. Maybe Flor and her sister's would have been happy; like fifty other family's around here. but they always pity the man, and trash the girl; and they have to live with a lie forever. Tis, a pity. Warren Jeffs is most likely, with ten or fifteen men, the only one who does not abuse children and girls, and the men always blame him as if it does not count; just like Flora. It is a pity, for sure. And with the state swearing to destroy every good, honest person because of religion; they always put the preditor on a pedistle too, and trash those not guilty
So, again it only comes back to the state and their paid murder's.
Jam Inn:
What do you expect us to do about Warren Jeffs?
There is nothing that Bill nor I can do about Warren Jeffs. There never was. All we could ever do for Warren Jeffs was wish him a fair trial.
(The same applies to the Texas Twelve.)
I wonder if the RCMP will "Investigate" the case as well as the Texas Rangers "Investigated" the negress?
I specifically remember several Canadian children who were kidnapped and raped by Texas at the Eldorado Baptist Church by CPS and CASA (See Trent's piece in his blog concerning the matter)
A full month AFTER the children all returned to Canada, CPS was still insisting they were "Caring for" them in Texas.
The fact was, CPS didn't have a clue where those children were, and despite all the bullshit about "Monitoring" them following barbies bitch slap from the Appeals Court, they never ONCE went back to the Ranch to "Make sure the children were safe".
You seem more concerned with the safety of the children than CPS or CASA is. Why do you suppose that just might be? You ain't still trying to get a peek at their underpants are you jam it in?
I guess your new BFF will be Lyle since your buddy Willie has been kicked to the curb!!!
If Willie Jessop has been excommunicated, why do you think Bill would allow it to affect his friendship with Willie?
If someone I knew was excommunicated, I would not allow it to affect our friendship (unless the person did something horrible, such as murder someone.)
I would also allow my friend to make his/her own decision about how to handle his/her excommuication. If my friend wanted to rejoin the FLDS church as Pliggy did, I would support his/her decision. After all, it's my friend's life. I don't believe that it is my place to tell another adult how to live.
If my friend chose to take his family and fight the FLDS church like Ross Chatwin, I would support his/her decision too. A friend allows you to be yourself and to do what you have to do.
If my friend decided one way and later changed his mind, I would still support my friend. A true friend never says, "I told you so."
So why do you think Bill would allow rumors about Willie to affect their friendship?
"Rumers" is the operative word here.
So far, we've heard who the apostates say happened.
Has anyone heard from someone actually within the F LDS Church?
As for who my friends are, I do not, and never have determined who my friends are based upon a whim.
Fair weather friends actually piss me off. Take Little Debbie for example; Where ARE all of her so called "Friends"?
I read the local rag, I see NOBODY claim her as a pal today.
Yes, she used CASA money for personal junkets, but there were 6 blimps going on those Vegas junkets, all from CASA, ALL from San Angelo.
You aren't suggesting they paid for themselves are you? These kinds of ghouls pay for NOTHING.
When Willie tells you he is no longer a member of the FLDS, THEN you can speculate as to why, but until then, all you have is the lying words of Carolyn to go on. If that asshole had any credibility, she would still have her own children backing her.
By the way, ask Carolyn why she doesn't dare cross the border in to Canada. If she shows her face there, she has some explaining to do to a Judge she has made claims before, and he wants her to either PROVE her statements, or go to prison for purjury and filing a false affidavit.
Things work a little different in Canada, if you charge someone with a crime, you BETTER be able to prove you are correct.
On the Canadian front, here's a story you won't be reading in Daffy's rag anytime soon:
The Canadian prosecutor told the Judge about a 14 year old girl who had her ass beat in by her husband because she gave birth to the wrong sexed child.
"Daddy" beat her so badly the girl was permanently crippled for LIFE.
The Prosecutor went on to tell the Judge that this was the kind of thing Canada could expect if polygamy were allowed under the Charter of Rights.
Now if the Judge were barbie or a Fat Jack Skeen, the prosecutor probably would have gotten away with his true story.
The problem was, the Judge asked a simple question; "When did this occur?".
It took a little while, but after about 15 minutes of prodding the prosecutor reported that the beating took place in the late 1800s.
This is the kind of bullshit that is making this Judge one pissed off dude.
Just as Utah did with the U.E.P., Canadian prosecutors are putting all their eggs in the "Let's bash Warren" basket. It didn't work on Judge Benson, and it won't work in Canada either.
I don't know Deb Brown, but if she did something wrong, she must be responsible for her actions, just as anyone should be?!!!
So, you don't think Mr. Jeffs is kicking out people left and right? You gotta be kidding? It's all over the news!! And from his Texas jail cell; he must be going off the deep end.
And, I don't know Carolyn, so I have no clue what you are talking about as far as Canada goes???
You're obviously smokin something. Carolyn can come and go from Canada as she pleases and she has all her kids with her and theynsupport what she does. You have no clue anything about Carolyn.
I dare you to prove what you said about the prosecutor in Canada. The transcripts from the hearing are all over the net. Find it and prove you aren't lying like you do about so much stuff.
As for Willie, he's out. He's storming around the Crick foaming at the mouth. I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't decide to testify against Warren in his trial. He's that mad. I know that first hand from watching him. It isn't a pretty site.
As I understand, Mr. Jeffs kicked out 45 of them. With that many, surely 1 or more of them will turn against him???
Don't have to worry about Texas destroying flds, Mr. Jeffs is doing a pretty good job of it himself. Just sit back and watch it all tumble like dominoes.
All them "Broken bones" were also all over the news.
How about them 31 pregnant "Teens". ?
Have Dorans dogs found any dead babies yet?
How about all them welfare checks?
Tell me again about the "Crematorium" in the Temple.
It don't seem strange to you morons that the ONLY court who has made anything stick with these people is barbies, and that's ONLY until it can be heard by a real court of law?
Warren Jeff's today is "Cleaner' than Tom Delay.
As for Carolyn, keep your eyes open, you will NOT see her feet on Canadian soil.
As for my being wrong on the U.E.P., the return of the children, the AZ case never coming to Trial because of Elissa Purjury and the Utah conviction being overturned on Appeal, you boys have to remember that I was ready and willing to place CASH MONEY on the outcomes of ALL of them and not one of you had the balls to take me up on the bets.
Here's your chance to put your money where your mouth is once again:
$100.00 says the Canada Court Upholds the F LDS Church under the Charter or Rights.
$100.00 says that the Federal Court throws out the Search Warrants used by barbie in her fishing expedition in April, 2008
Let's end all your bullshit, put some cash on the bar or go straighten out your dresses you pack of pussies!
BillM it's spelled correctly as "Rumors" not "Rumers" and perjury not purjury. If you can't get the wording right, BillM, how can anyone expect you to get the facts right, either. Of course, your smarter than any judge, elected official or uniformed law enforcement officer, right BillM? Michael Emack, according to you Bill is innocent but he has plead guilty to both sexual assault and bigamy. Allen Steed, according to you Bill is innocent but he has plead guilty to sexual assault and solemnization of unlawful wedlock.
So as a child advocate you obviously suffer from maleficence but it's not like you could ever be issued a state licensing, anyway. Is your credibility sagging with your defense of two rapists who have now both plead guilty?
Gee..... BillM is this to Free or Breed the FLDS Children?
Bill, Carolyn has already been back to Canada. No problems.
As for the Trust, it won't go to the FLDS, it will belong to Brent Jeffs, Elissa Wall and then lost boys. They all have Judgments against it. Nice thought though.
I guess your credibility went down the tubes as well;
It's "You're" (YOU ARE) and not "Your".
Playing semantic games may be cute, but do nothing for your (Get it?) complete lack of a reasonable argument.
You make idiotic claims, and when they're (It reads; They are.)responded to, you ignore the truth and move on to your (Get it again?) next sexual fantasy.
You need to decide if you plan to be an English teacher or someone with a reasonable argument in answer to yore (Here's one for you to hang your defense on) asinine rants.
Maybe BEFORE the Federaql Court Ruling, any claim against the Trust MIGHT have been valid.
However, the fact is that the Hole Bros, Lindberg and Wisan were all in bed together carving up the Trust.
The "Settlement" with Wisan is now as Legal as the Deed's he gave out and the Leases he entered into. From a Legal standpoint, they are not worth the paper they were printed on, ask any Law School student.
As the Judge said, Lindberg was on illegal grounds the MOMENT she changed the Trust, and had no Legal authority to remain there.
A little education is necessary here:
Page 17 of the Decision;
"Virtually from its first step after it decided to reform the Trust, the state court was in forbidden territory. It not only had no authority to determine the "Just wants and needs" of the members of the FLDS church, but it had no authority to interpret of reform the Trust at all."
If I held a Deed, a Lease, a "Settlement" or an Invoice for services performed for or against the Trust during Wisan's illegal tenure as the "New Bishop", I'd be sweating my balls off knowing full well that it could NEVER be Legally enforced in a Court of Law.
EVERYTHING Wisan did, he was doing without Legal authority. Not even Linberg herself had any authority regarding the Trust.
Yes, Utah will Appeal. All they need to do to prevail, is to get both the Supreme Court of the United States AND the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals to reverse prior Decisions THEY have made, and Utah is home free.
Good luck on that one!
As for the apostates now living in the Creek, I would start packing if you didn't FULLY comply with the U.E.P.
Richard, your "Deed's" are worthless, you need to try to get your money back from Bruce. Good luck.
Well BullM leave it as,"Rumers" is the operative word here". Semantics has to do with definitions and spelling has to do with the proper letters used to write a word. So by definition you display your lack of education and your spelling is proof of your poor journalistic skills, ye olde jounalist. No degree, no credentials and no credibility sums you up fairly well.
Keep pumping out your misspelled wordings and improper grammatical uses for all that I care.
Don't duck the questions BullM are Michael Emack and Allen Steed guilty or innocent? They have plead that they're guilty.
Are you going to change your blog name to 'Breed the FLDS Children"? It won't be long until evidence is entered into trial that proves Warren S. Jeffs is guilty of aggravated sexual assault at the YFZ Ranch.
The semantics reference involved your intentions to indicate that one who misspells a word, has no credibility.
My intention was to demonstrate (Successfully) you're (You are) not quite the English Major you make out to be.
It was a little longer than merely telling you to fuck off because you're (There it is again!) an asshole.
As for your continually reverting back to your favorite sexual fantasy (That of screwing little girls), I guess if this is the best way you have found of obtaining gratification, I feel sorry for you (But not a whole hellavalot).
The men on the Ranch knew from the very beginning that whatever they pleaded was meaningless, they will be freed once the SW are thrown out.
Having them plead NO CONTEST to a charge is slightly different than pleading guilty, but I didn't expect you to understand that anyway.
The important thing is that they preserved their right to Appeal the validity of the SW, so that is all that matters.
As to whether or not it bothers me that there may have been some young women who gave birth that were Mormon, I would say not anymore than it bothers you that there are a hundred girls in SAISD for every single Mormon girl from the Ranch who ended up pregnant.
When it comes to screwing little girls, the good old boys have that little trick down pat.
No, it doesn't bother me unless I hear from the girl herself that she didn't want to become a mother.
http://www.azfamily.com/news/Warren-Jeffs-sends-letter-to-President-demanding-to-be-released-117114663.html
Your hero is losing his marbles.
Also, as for Elissa, she's never settled with anyone, so the Trust still owes her. Oh yeah, if the trust reform was invalid then any settlements it made are invalid and that puts us back to square one where Brent, Elissa and the lost boys own the trust.
Anybody who looks to a politician to solve their problems is as nutty as anyone who goes to a goon for help. You'll get screwed long before you get any help.
Elissa "Won" her case with the assistance of the Hole Bros., working hand-in-hand with Wisan, Lindberg and Fisher as part of Lindberg's plan to destroy the F LDS Church.
The same exact thing happened with Brent and the "Lost Boys".
With the Federal Court's Ruling, that is now a defunct group operating above the Law on forbidden territory to interfere with a Religious entity.
Fisher has his own problems now, having used 501(c)(3) Tax Free money to further his personal vendetta.
Anytime Elissa wants to try to collect any "Award" she is welcome to, and at the same time she can explain the perjury Jane Blackmore was paid to produce on her behalf regarding her medical records.
The case in Arizona wasn't dropped to give Texas the opportunity to prosecute Warren, it was dropped because putting Elissa on stand under Oath would be the kiss of death for AZ OR UT.
If anybody thinks Texas is going to be putting Elissa on the Stand, they have rocks in their heads. Even barbie herself isn't THAT stupid.
besides, when I was being targeted the most, by these barbarian's that wanted me dead, so they did not get caught abusing children, (which they did anyhow, but it was kept quiet, because they were not supporting Warren Jeffs) this lady from the state that was trashing me, for the preditor's, did ask me who the next leader of our church was, so they could kill him. I testify to you and all the World that it would not have mattered who took this position; they intended to destroy for religion. And so far all the insane murders are being stopped now too. If the law does not stop them the Lord will. so complain all you like. If Warren Jeffs truly put you out, then it was for a good reason. And weep farther, for there are a good, few more that needs sent packing.
And I do know some people who would go into court and lie to a Judge and think nothing of it. So, how are you to know all this gossip anyhow. So, the media said; well, I have yet to see anything the media said as truth. but I know these murders and liars and theifs. and bitch about my spelling now. it makes you look good; and every one is still a liar that is a liar. I know who lied about me, and their wicked stories.
BillM says about underaged sexual contact with an adult, "No, it doesn't bother me unless I hear from the girl(victim) herself that she didn't want to become a mother". You state here that breeding is more important than existant laws? Spoken like a true FLDS-Yesman BillM but since when can a minor give consent to have sex while underage with an adult? Seems you have a problem with observing existing laws. I think sex with a minor is illegal, no matter what your religion. How can being coerced to marry in Canada be OK for a Canadian youth that has been illegally sex trafficked across our national border to the YFZ Ranch?
You don't care about preserving any child's rights beyond condoning aggravated rape as a religious tenet. Good luck trying to convince anyone that this isn't a hardened criminals rationale.
Sine Allen Steed entered a plea of guilty and is now in prison, Elissa's claim looks pretty good. The fact that the lawsuit was never answered means she won. Kiss the trust goodbye.
On another note, you have no proof that Elissa lied or that Jane lied and since Allen plead guilty, it makes their testimony look good.
There's a HUGE difference (Legally) between jail and prison. I don't call 30 days (Which means 10) in jail a "Prison sentence".
As for having children having sex, there are well over 300 of them in the SAISD, do you see any tanks rolling on the school?
Matter of fact, the front page news story in Dallas concerned the celebration of the First Birth of the year... to a "Child" last year. Did you read anything about snipers pointing rifles at the girl? How about a gaggle of dykes hauling her off to foster "Care"?
It seems to bother you that Mormons have sex, but Baptists get a pass. Why is that? Do Baptist "Children" mature faster than them Mormons?
Does "The Law" say that there is a difference between a Mormon and a Baptist?
(Actually, yes it does. Harvey's Law is purely made for Mormon's. THAT makes it un constitutional and I do not blame anyone for ignoring it.)
BillM your lame argument that because teen age fornication exists then FLDS Church marrying underaged girls into polygyny is allowable? Two problems that need redress doesn't exonerate one to be allowed because the other persists, so dumb BillM can this qualify you as a true 'child advocate? Hardly! Brigham Young argued that 'Gentile' prostitution existed and his Mormon brand of bigamy was to be preferred to soiled doves, which is equally flawed and misguided ethical argument.
You want FLDS children to be 'Free' to be victimized by the FLDS Priesthood and you know best but events in Canada is triggering yet another investigation into sex trafficking of children. You really think a young teenager that becomes pregnant from premarital sex with her boyfriend is comparable to Bishop Merril Jessop, at age 67 years, marrying Brandon Blackmore's daughter, at 15 years and sex trafficked from Canada? Is this girl named Sarah?
Your obsession with little girls is getting really fucking old.
For 170 years Texans have been gleefully fucking little girls, right up until the Mormons came to town, and then all of a sudden Y'all got religion.
Sorry I don't buy your bullshit.
Selectively enforcing any laws may amuse you, but until the goons apply the law equally to everyone, don't expect anybody to respect them.
What I had wanted to do was to keep this forum open to all comments without having to go through any hoops to comment.
Since Jam it in has nothing to say other than to try to further his/her obsession with little girls having sex, that's now impossible.
He/she needs to go masturbate someplace else, I don't want to be bothered.
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